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 What happens after you've become enlightened?

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Aaron
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PostSubject: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Wed Oct 31, 2007 9:19 pm

What do you think happens after you've become enlightened? I mean what do you do with yourself, teach, go about your daily business, go sit under a tree and melt in with existence?

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Helium



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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Wed Oct 31, 2007 11:11 pm

That's a good question. Well I gotta family to help house and feed so it's a moot point at the moment for me! lol!
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Thu Nov 01, 2007 12:25 am

Enlightenment... pah! We all die the same in the end.

The only enlightenment there is, is the realization and acceptance that there is none.
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Thu Nov 01, 2007 1:42 am

Don't know that I would completely rule it out Uriah. I mean people have been hit with sudden insights in all variety of disciplines and I wouldn't rule out the sacred in that equation.

I still have every hope I'll awake one day to find I have rhythm and am just in tune with the universe, man. Cheers! Brick Wall lol! d'oh
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:17 am

If simply being in tune with the universe is enlightenment then I think my old dog achieves Nirvana every afternoon when the grass is still warm and the sun is behind the house. My dog is a Zen master. Laughing

But what's enlightenment? Just a good idea? Hell I have those all the time, we all do - well, most of us anyway. But we can't just accept that every person who claims to have experienced a vision, or has some kind of spiritual eureka moment and now wants to share their epiphanic revelation with the rest of us. Most of humanity's ideas - from a historical perspective - have been pretty bad, and the odd correlation between and idea's success and its hindsighted realization to having been bad from the outset is scary, pervasive to a point where one must begin to think if there is a design, flawed human perception must indeed be an integral and important part of it.
David Berkowitz, for instance, believed that his neighbor's dog was barking the voice of Satan. That idea isn't nearly as bad as the new idea that idea gave him. That's how bad idea's spread: Like a cultural game of memetic telephone. Anyway, I'm just saying - there's a fine line between enlightenment and schizophrenia, a line human spirituality has consistently straddled.
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Thu Nov 01, 2007 10:50 am

IMO, enlightenment is more a path or a journey then a destination. I think as we learn and develop our path becomes brighter and brigher but I don't think there is a location where that path ever really ends. In that regard enlightenment is like a singularity so the question of what happens "after" enlightenment isn't really accurate.

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Helium



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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Thu Nov 01, 2007 10:26 pm

Ah so it was a trick question!

I agree with your assessment Aaron.

I also see truth in what Uriah says but as usual I am suspicious of his criticisms of our ancient ancestors. I think his facts are correct, but, if you will I might dispute his conclusions.

I promise I will advance a string on that very issue soon, hopefully this weekend although I gotta basement ful of painting line up.
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Fri Nov 02, 2007 2:01 am

disappointment.
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Aaron
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:18 am

Helium wrote:
Ah so it was a trick question!

Yeah it was a bit of a bait I guess... Smile

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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Fri Nov 02, 2007 9:19 am

michael1111 wrote:
disappointment.

Well that's certainly part of it too.

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Wandered Off



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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Fri Nov 02, 2007 2:31 pm

"After enlightenment, the laundry." - Josh Billings
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:17 pm

Good one... Smile

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Helium



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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Fri Nov 02, 2007 3:45 pm

Yeah, ain't that the truth Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Sat Nov 03, 2007 4:43 pm

If being enlightened means to become a Buddha; then perhaps what that really means is that after years and years of rigorous meditation upon the conjuction of the transcendent and immanent in his nature, Siddharta finally realized "That" is the illusion; gave it all up when he intentionally broke is fast, devoured a bowl of rice, and then came back to the civilization to teach people how to live a balanced well proportioned life--the golden means of Aristotle; or as they'd say in the virtue ethics of classical times: Nothing in excess, not even moderation.

We must always keep in mind that all the legends that've grown around Mahatma Buddha are quite false. His life events, even in the Pali text, were recorded almost three centuries after his demise. And if you look at the core of his teachings: it is void of any metaphysical speculation; an indication that enlightenment is nothing else but a conscientous everyday living.

And yet, still, in Buddhism and other Eastern religions there is something mystical surrounding the notion of Buddhi. However, that can easily be explained by the extreme superstitious and backward mentality of ordinary non-westernized non-secular Indians. Just think how odd the fundamentalists appear in the West; and then consider the fact that in the East, fundamentalism and literalism is the norm. I mean, the Indians still worship animals and Chinese still pray to the dead souls of their ancestors. If that doesn't sound much different than our Protestants or Catholics fundamentalists and literalists, then add to that the fact that the sense of systematic critical inquiry never gained any prominence in the East, and so their confidence in the actuality of "Buddhi" is simply a manifestation of their ignorance.

It is they who are in the cave, and only see shadows--not withstanding our Western mystics who come to believe that the rational mind is entrapped in chains of dogma.
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Mon Nov 05, 2007 10:32 am

Hello deist. Smile What about more western models of enlightenment? Do you think they hold any validity?

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Helium



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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Tue Nov 06, 2007 2:15 am

Quote :
What about more western models of enlightenment.

Western models of enlightenment. Hmmm. Is that not an oxymoron? The west can't see beyond Brittany Spears latest breakdown, meanwhile making her rich. Strictly beer, bread and circuses while the barbarians (or should I say fundies) threaten the borders. Brick Wall
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Tue Nov 06, 2007 11:05 am

Helium wrote:
Quote :
What about more western models of enlightenment.

Western models of enlightenment. Hmmm. Is that not an oxymoron?

Yes, in fact Deism is a result of western models of enlightenment.

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Uriah

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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Tue Nov 06, 2007 2:06 pm

Helium wrote:
Quote :
What about more western models of enlightenment.

Western models of enlightenment. Hmmm. Is that not an oxymoron? The west can't see beyond Brittany Spears latest breakdown, meanwhile making her rich. Strictly beer, bread and circuses while the barbarians (or should I say fundies) threaten the borders. Brick Wall

That's a fairly ergregious generalization you're making there. "Enlightenment" - in the practical sense, is nothing but a cultural meme addressing how to approach individual spirituality. Because the West is a culture of social collectivism, our spiritual memes are also collective, in that they require the individual to look outside the self for fullfilment. The Eastern idea of enlightenment - at least as it is translated by Western generalizations - is that one should look within to find spirit.

It should be understood that the entire idea displayed here has nothing so much to do with actual differences between the East and the West, but rather with Western perceptions of the differences between the East and West.

In reality, Britney Spears - and the overly comercialized, super-saturated, infotainment extravaganza of media which she represents - is a worldwide phenomenon. Birthed in the West to be sure, but embraced by all cultures. Is India's social outcry of Richard Gere kissing one of their beloved actresses less superficial than Americans caring about Ms. Spears' parenting skills, or lack thereof?
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Tue Nov 06, 2007 3:29 pm

Uriah wrote:
Because the West is a culture of social collectivism, our spiritual memes are also collective...

IMO, our spiritual memes are collective due to a lack of development spiritually. The majority of americans are stuck at a "conformist" level of spiritual development and never really give much thought to their beliefs other than what their parents taught them about it. This is often true of the non-religious as well.

Uriah wrote:
It should be understood that the entire idea displayed here has nothing so much to do with actual differences between the East and the West, but rather with Western perceptions of the differences between the East and West.

That's true. Eastern religion is often just as spiritually collective as western religion epistemologically speaking and even more so in other areas of life. There does seem to be a general difference between eastern and western metaphysics however.

The difference between eastern and western philosophy is almost nonexistant though IMO.

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Helium



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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Tue Nov 06, 2007 9:07 pm

yes, good points, Aaron, Uriah.
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Wed Nov 07, 2007 2:20 am

an aching back is also a symptom of enlightenment.

i gotta go take some tylenol...
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Wed Nov 07, 2007 3:51 am

Aaron wrote:
The difference between eastern and western philosophy is almost nonexistant though IMO.

I agree, at the root of them all are the same principals.
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Wed Nov 07, 2007 7:17 am

Enlightenment in my opinion comes with the realization we're all just guessing.
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Aaron
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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Wed Nov 07, 2007 10:26 am

michael1111 wrote:
an aching back is also a symptom of enlightenment.

i gotta go take some tylenol...

Hmmm... you mean that's been my problem all these years? I thought it was just a bad case of psyatica. Smile

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PostSubject: Re: What happens after you've become enlightened?   Tue Dec 18, 2007 4:31 am

Aaron wrote:
What do you think happens after you've become enlightened? I mean what do you do with yourself, teach, go about your daily business, go sit under a tree and melt in with existence?

I don't think we should worry or even think about what we would or might do if or when we become Enlightened. First we must start the true Path to Enlightenment, and then simply let things flow and unravel. We will know what we are to do through EXPERIENCING the LIGHT.

In other words, we must not try to run before we can walk.

Peace, Love, & Understanding Very Happy

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